New song idea I came up with...

[CJB100]

well it def needs some work, but i made the whole entire bulk of this song in about 2 hours earlier today.

not sure exactly what i am going to do to spice it up, but rest assured that this is not the final version. but also rest assured that it isn't crap either.

Link-age!

guitar is a fender (omg so i use a frikin fender who really cares? lol. my fender sounds quite a lot less strat-ily than most anyways.) and amp is a beginner amp, came with the fender. doesn't really sound bad tho, except at the end.

very easy to play, even the "mini-solo" if you even wanna call it that, it's more like a bridge. mostly power chords, few little wierd hand positions, but mostly just simple rhythm sorta stuff.

drums are synthesized, but i could def play them irl. not too hard there either. hardly any drum fills. and the ones that are actually there are alot easier than they sound.

no bass yet, but i plan on synthesizing it. dunno bout bass i have never played one irl, so whatever i come up with'll prolly be a bit hard for ME, not to say good bassists like canped couldn't do them. they'll prolly be as easy as the rest of the song.

PLEASE listen and tell me what you think. (Especially canped and hzac, since you guys know a lot about music, i'd really value your opinions.)

[iamdaddy]

Well i downloaded it, but im not very musically talented in the least. I liked the general sound of it though, not as if that imeans a lot i guess.

[CJB100]

haha dude i'll take any and all criticism and praise haha. thnx.

[canped]

You need to learn about sequencing drums. Edit the velocity settings to match the playing style of a real drummer.

The riff at 1:00 is pretty cool but the chord sequence before it is far too predictable. Mix it up and augment some of the chords. In fact, I'd ditch it comepletely. Its not working at all. Needs a major rethink. Same for the part at 2:54. Its too forced a shift, if you know what I mean. You can BUILD to that kind of feel but I think it might be better with a key change and a maybe a second guitar part with a different rhythm coming in? Something like Metallica's 'One'?

Overall, the vibe and feel of the track is pretty good. Needs bass and vocals, obviously. I like the down-tempo ending.

[CJB100]

yah i get what your saying with the "chorus" kinda part at 1:00. i'll try and maybe think up something a bit more in style with the rest of the track. it just doesn't really flow all that well at all and i more or less just put it in there so i could have a basic verse/chorus/bridge/verse/chorus/bridge set up in there. (which a lot of people say is a bad thing to fall into that kind of setup, but i truthfully don't care too much about that)

as for the drums, there isn't a lot i can do, at least with the synthesizer i am using; it is extremely limited. it more or less just uses individual drum sounds in wav format. and even if the synthesizer WASN'T limited, i would prolly not have the patience to do that right off the bat. After all this is just the first draft.

But i am planning on getting a drumset in about 6 months or so. And then i'll just be playing the drums, but i'll prolly need to look into how to successfully record it (at least moderately well; as i understand it drums can be somewhat difficult to record?)

and the part at 2:54 is kinda predictable actually. but i kinda like it and it flows well as far as tonal qualities go. but i noticed that it was a (more than forced) VERY forced transition.

I am not sure yet how i am going to make a smooth transition into that, but as far as the transition between that chord sequence goes and the outro, i want to keep that the same.

And while I am at it I will prolly make those chords into full bar chords instead of just regular old power chords; they sound a bit weak.

Thanx for the review! ;D

[hzac]

Hey man.. sorry for the late reply.. been a bit busy lately.

Ok well let me start by saying i know for a fact that you can do better than this.. Im not really a fan of this track.. To me it doesnt flow as well as it should and it frustrates me.

Let me hit you with this.. the song is WAY WAY to simple.. for my personal taste anyway.. I hate to say it but to me its like you copy and pasted the first half od the song to make the second half.. You have to be more creative with your song structuring.. Otherwise your songs are just going to be one of those ones that are catchy but everyone hates.

I know i probably just stated a fair bit of what you have already covered but it needs to be emphasized. I am just not a fan of bands that use soft verses then jimmy up the chorus or whatever to make their song get stuck in peoples heads.. you listen to the radio.. half the [censored] on there you will know exaclty what im talking about.

The distortion part is catchy but its like every other song out there.. paccasbella (sp) anyone? Try some chord progression and dont be afriad to expand your song as much as possible.. just becuase it doesnt fit a song structure.. who gives a [censored].. as long as the song has parts that people genuinely like becuase the music is well written.. not some jacked off chorus for money.. god i hate the radio.

Like i said you have the ppotential at that 1min riff is starting to show it but expansion and alot of it is needed to wow someone. Keep trying dude.. i hope i covered atleast a little bit of something you wanted to hear. any questions just let me know

[CJB100]

lol ya most of the 2 or so hours i spent making this were on going up and down scales and patterns taken from scales trying to see what i liked and didn't like. and truthfully the riff feels far from finished to me.

i'll prolly put up like two or three "finished copies" before i get to one i am satisfied with. not to mention the copies i won't consider finished at all.

also, this is my first time recording. all my other stuff is synthesized. so this was just bound to be simple, at least for the first and second draft. there is no doubt that the riff (at least for right now) is the highlight of the song.

I hate to say it but to me its like you copy and pasted the first half od the song to make the second half..

this is true. that's exactly what happened. why i do that, i don't really know for sure. i just think i like to have a general structure and song length down to kinda see how long i can keep interest. then i generally add stuff in as the song progresses. or at least that's how i've done it in the past.

Otherwise your songs are just going to be one of those ones that are catchy but everyone hates.

I can ride my bike with no handlebars... no handlebars.. no handlebars...

Try some chord progression and dont be afriad to expand your song as much as possible..

Chord progression is something that i have came across pretty consistantly in music i like and music that i would want to sound similar to. But i am most definately a novice at guitar. Only been doing it a year, and only been doing it SERIOUSLY (practicing close to every day, for 30min - 4 hours per day) for the past half a month or so. Is there anything really difficult about chord progression or is it a relatively simple topic that could be wrapped up here w/o taking up a whole page to discuss?

Thanx for the review hzac. ;D

[canped]

Getting a good drum sound is 60% room, 25% micing and 15% mixing. You can get a great drum sound with just one or two mics (Led Zepplin's stuff just uses a single mic on the drums). You need quality, though, definitly over quantity. Get one decent large diaphragm condensor mic and it'll serve you better than the cheap 'full kit' mic sets. You can spot-mic (i.e. put another mic) on the kick and snare if it really needs it but you'd be suprised how good drums can sound with minimal setup.

[hzac]

Nov 8, 2008 1:27:51 GMT -5 CJB100 said:

Chord progression is something that i have came across pretty consistantly in music i like and music that i would want to sound similar to. But i am most definately a novice at guitar. Only been doing it a year, and only been doing it SERIOUSLY (practicing close to every day, for 30min - 4 hours per day) for the past half a month or so. Is there anything really difficult about chord progression or is it a relatively simple topic that could be wrapped up here w/o taking up a whole page to discuss?

Thanx for the review hzac. ;D

I forgot you were still learning man. Sorry.. I seem to forget and assume everyone is at the same level

[CJB100]

nah it's all cool man. but can you tell me a bit about chord progression? i looked it up on wikipedia but as usual unless your already very educated in what you're reading it makes next to no sense.

EDIT:: and thanx canped for the advice. i'll start lookin around at some drumsets, and one of those mic's. see how much the total cost is.

also, can you tell me, what kind of snares and toms and bass drums seem to be best. i know alot about the cymbals and hihats and rides and splashes and whatnot but it just occured to me i have never payed much attention to the other things... which snares and toms i would imagine you'd want something with a really deep sound and a lot of... idk what exactly to call it... rebound? in short what sounds best and it doesn't feel like hitting a brick wall? lol. and is there anything to watch out for with the bass pedal/drum (besides the very basics)?

[canped]

Don't buy stag stuff; that's the first point. Perosnally, I'd suggest sticking to the main brands- Tama, Pearl, Mapex etc. Even their starter kits are quality stuff that will keep you going to quite a while. The pedal is very important but if you buy one of the big name starter kits, it'll come with it. Bad pedals will severly affect your playing; I prefer Tama but there's a whole bunch of great stuff to choose from. If you had a price range in mind (including the mic), I can be more precise.

Again, if your kit is decent, the sound will come from the room and mic setup more than the drums themselves.

[CJB100]

i was thinking drums alone around $500-600. maybe $650 at most (not including tax. but if i could get something decent for that then cool). mic and drums preferebly not over $800.

and yah i've played on kits with bad pedals and i know how they feel but is there anything to look for in specific for the bass pedal. i've played on crappy snare and tom drums and they don't concern me half as much. but it's still sorta important to have that kind of "drumsticks-bounce-off-the-drums" effect. makes better for rolls and some fills.

[canped]

I'd say drums-percussion.musiciansfriend.com/product/Mapex-QR-Fusionese-22-Custom-Wrap-Drum-Set?sku=490287 seems about right. Plus about $200 for cymbals leavs $200 to get a couple of decent mics. All the big-name drum pedals feel very similar; Tama tend to have less 'spring' but you can change it all in the setup eith the drum key and make it as solid or loose as you like, unlike cheaper ones that you can tighten all you like and it won't make a bit of difference.

I think if you get 2 of these pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/AudioTechnica-AT2020-Large-Diaphragm-Cardioid-Condenser-Microphone?sku=270620 its a very good start. The only issue is that they won't be a perfectly matched pair, which MAY cause problems if you were to use them as a stereo pair but just for drums, you'd only be doing that with the addition of at least a kick drum mic, so that's cool.

I'd put one above the kit in the middle and the other to the side of the snare drum, not pointing directly at it, aiming at the kick drum. You can look around for a hundred different 2-mic drum setups or have fun and invent your own.

Generally, those mics should serve you well for guitar ambiance (not directly micing an amp!, it should be 6x the distance from the amp to the close mic away from the close mic. If the close mic is 6 inches from the amp, the ambiant mic should be 36 inches from the close mic), vocals and pretty much anything you want to record. Cello, xylophone... anything. They're very good for the price but you'd be better getting them from your local store than getting them online.

The only thing is that you may need to buy a powered DI box to get the phantom power (power supply using an XLR or 'mic' cable) to the mic. They're pretty cheap and very useful. You could run your bass directly into the computer with it (and should).

By the way, what are you using to record with because that'll impact on whether you need this stuff or what other stuff you might need, or not.

[CJB100]

well right now i am recording with my amp with a direct line to the mic slot on my laptop. i've done the same with keyboard. and it's been working out so far... i've had my friend record some vocals (not for this song) using just a regular pc mic, used for speech recognition mostly, with some amazingly good results. i have no clue but everything seems to just work with little to no effort on my part when recording to my laptop. lol XD.

and i found a nice mapex. $400. had everything except a ride, which i could buy at a local store called fork's drum closet (dunno if you've ever heard of them... prolly not) for between $50-$200. Basically what i am looking for is a set with a minimum of 3 toms, a snare, a hi-hat, crash (i sorta know the sound i am looking for but don't know the exact kind of crash), ride (pretty much any kind will do), and of course bass drum.

and i found a simmons electronic drumset. generally electronic drumsets are somewhat limited. but this thing was very good actually. only one real drawback i saw: no function for a rim shot or anything of that nature really. which most rolland sets have rimshot functions but next to no functions for velocity, which means everything always sounds as hard hit as possible. it was nice. i'll try and find a pic really quick..



lol'd the "brain" is a bit older, but it's not out of date. it's 600$ brand new. plus the pedal, which is like $69. this is a good electronic set. guy said it lasts a very long time. and i tested it out for a long while; it was very nice, pretty much could handle anything i threw at it... cept for the rim shot, lol. so idk.. i'll see. thanx for the ino man.

[canped]

Most drummers will say that an electric kit should only ever mbe considered after you own an acoustic kit as they are no substitute.

Screw most drummers; if you can play an electric kit well, then you can get much better results with your recording setup. You need to see if the kit has a USB output; if not, you need a MIDI-USB hub for your computer- you'll be using software sounds, not the kit's sounds for the best results.

pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/EMu-Xmidi-2X2-USB-MIDI-interface?sku=240551

I would really recommend getting a simple audio interface, though. The Line 6 stuff is great if you think you'd get much use out of the amp-modelling software (and the way you're recording guitar- yes, you would!).

pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Line-6-TonePort-UX2-USB-RecordingModeling-Interface?sku=249701

Or one with good mic pre-amps.

pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/PreSonus-INSPIRE-1394-FireWire-Audio-Interface?sku=241483

pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Digidesign-Mbox-2-Mini-?sku=700498 (that includes ProTools recording/sequencing software. If you want to go down that road. It changes what plugins are available to you and if you ever want it upgrade it'll cost a lot more (for extra inputs, for example) but it's all-inclusive and easy-ish to use).

I'll admit I don't know much about drums, but I'm 3/4 HND qualified in this stuff, so if you have any questions at all, I'll be glad to answer, explain and research to find the best setup for you.

[CJB100]

Screw most drummers; if you can play an electric kit well, then you can get much better results with your recording setup.

LOL finally someone actually gets it! haha. all i ever here is:

"dood! wtf y u so stupid? get real set man. real set good. electronic = 'tarded!"

which i would be like that too but that set up there is for a very reasonable price considering most sets are around $1000-1500 and i mainly just wanna be able to plug it up to my cpu and record without loads of equipment.

and yes, the drumset module has usb and my cpu has a "midi in" line anyways. which it's awfully wierd that it just always happens to work out like that with all my stuff.. but o well. i guess i am just lucky like that.

o and i dunno if the line 6 stuff will help me too much anyways... my MAGIX software is mainly for mixing and mastering. i guess that's why it's synthesizers suck [censored]. <.< but yah i'm looking at some screenshots of that line six stuff, and it looks almost the same as my software actually. so i might check into that some but by the way it looks im gonna guess both the products do just about the same thing.

[canped]

Nah; the Line 6 stuff gives you the hardware you'll need to record stuff with some great guitar sounds as well. This will give you a lot of what you need to start seriously making tracks. If MAGIX supports VST plugins, that'll be a great bonus- if not, I'll sort ya out with the good stuff. You need phantom power for mics but if you're just going to use an electrobmic kit, then you'll only need that for vocals, in which case you should get a VST microphone instead. There's pure software alernatives to the line 6 stuff as well so really, yeah- you could do it all with a minimal budget if you get the electronic kit. Just get a good USB condensor mic for vocals and I'll PM you with the software details.

[CJB100]

thanx

i'll take a look at it sometime soon... but imma be really busy on some stuff til after thanxgiving. and then i'll have a week or two of mostly free time. but then come x-mas. so... imma be busy. lol.

ask derelict or sensay, i am a very busy person. i like never even have time to even chat with them via xfire anymore. makes me ALMOST wish those holidays didn't happen. or school. lol. i think after christmas tho i will have LOADS of time to get back into this stuff. kinda sux too cuz i only just recently took any serious interest in learning guitar. (although i have wanted drums for quite a while)

[lunchboxdave]

some of those riffs you got going in the song (like the intro riff) is pretty decent stuff. But it kinda starts losing direction a little bit when you come in with the distortion.

and about the line 6 stuff. i myself use the guitarport/rifftracker hardware/software. it has a lot of great modeling effects and comes with some drum samples that are set to your tempo. it also can support whatever you can plug into it with a 1/4 cable. its mainly used more as a scratch pad but i have managed to bang out a few songs with one of my bandmates. i do not suggest it though for serious recording.